Hello, I am looking for a little advice, I have been playing by ear for 20 years but I am trying to expand my horizons. I learned the g major scale 14 position system and was wondering if I should continue in that key and try to improve my sequence patterns, intervals etc...in the key of G before moving to another key or learn the other keys and then work on the different patterns? I know Pebber advised that I learn the 5 position system first in all keys but I started with the 14 because I got impatient.

Hi sstauf,

How about scheduling for a different key for each month. There are 12 sounding keys and 12 months in one year. So, you can cover the major scale in about one year. You would have to add and additional 3 months for the enharmonic keys.

I didn't use the 14 position system (the one i use has 7). So, each day of the week would be assigned a mode. In your case I guess you could do two position per day. Each position will have an 7th chord arpeggio, triads, etc. I hope this helps.

Hi John567, That sounds like a good plan, 1 month should be enough time to work on each key plus reviewing the keys as you go along. Thanks for the advice.

Change keys per month is great advice...

After a while try intermingling two keys...in other words....start changing keys as you practice/play.

Two keys I would recommend starting with are...G and C...try going Up G then Down C then visa versa.
Or just simply change the key you are playing...as long as you get the "key change" mechanically down.

Again...my 2 cents....

2 cents from FRaKh is like receiving 2 million dollars from a normal human being. All hail FRaKh and the planet he comes from.

:D

LoL!

thanx!

Thanks John & FRaKh for the advice, I like the idea of a key change, my plan is to change keys once per month, going up in 5ths. I also plan on starting a new scale sequence with each key change. Working on G using the 4 note sequence, next month I plan on going to D using the 3 note sequence and practicing one of the 14 positions per day, that would give me 2 weeks to get through the 14 positions and an extra 2 weeks to work on changing keys on the fly, Speaking of key changes, Obviously the pentonic scales are easier to play over chord changes, with the major scale do you almost need to make a key change for every chord change, I seem to have trouble incorporating the 2 extra notes with a standard 3 chord progression.

The scale sequences should be practice daily...routinely. These are what give you the tools to play (MECHANICALLY). the "Key" changes are what gives you familiarity with the actual scale definition patterns as well as the great tones(voices) they produce when changing keys.

As far as changing key through a chord progression....if it fits...??
I dont see why the pentatonic would be easier.....I would use a sort of free drop note pentatonic to improv with..???
I dont know the answer to this one besides FRaKhs pattern answer.

"if it fits....play it!"

i like sstauf's idea of running through one scales sequence per key so spending more time on one sequence at a time

now i was also concentrating on one position a day but running through all sequences everyday

Frakh which way would you advise time is not an issue.

I ran through as many as I could in a practice day....but.....spend at least 20-30 minutes on each. My good daily routine was at least 6 hours.
If you dont have that much time.....I would say concentrate at first with...
3rds
4ths
1234...2345 pattern

These three should be the basics.

Thats if you only have an hour or two to play.

Now if time isnt an issue.....

first
Warm up...trills ladders...30 min.

second
play each scale pattern 10x each...slowly

third
bump up the time and play them a little faster

fourth
start in on the sequences.
10x each per pattern

Thats how I would solve that problem.

And that would be for just one key....and concentrating on the left hand only.
Picking exercises are not even included...lol.

But that should work.

Another thing you would want to do is to write out each pattern 10x before you go to bed. Helps with memory.

Again thanks for the advice, I was trying to start out by practicing 3 sequences but found I was't improving too quickly with any of them so I was going to concentrate on 1 sequence for one key and then when I move to the next key add a second sequence and work on both sequences, the next key add a 3rd sequence and work on all 3 sequences etc... I wish I had 6 hours to practice daily, but I figure anything is better then nothing. I can usually get 1 or 2 hours in daily but it doesn't seem to be enough. Also good advice on writing things out, I have been writing down scale patterns along with the notes. It doesn't seem like I will ever be able to memorize all 12 keys. After you learned all the keys, how do you manage practicing them all? One day/week/month per key or just random?

Well i have decided to concentrate on 3rds three note sequence and triplet pattern, for Cb

will still go through all the others but spend like an hour on the ones i'm concentrating on.

Also remember to write the scaletones they wont change wherever you play a scale pattern

Dont Know how people have done 12 hours straight.
I have done 7 hours for the last two nights. ruddy hard

after doing some calculating it takes me 2 minutes to do a sequence 10 times
so for 3000 times it should take 10 hours each sequence each shape
so 2100 hours. around 88 days if I practice solid 10 hours a day
If my calculations are correct. best get to work then/ yea right

Delta is right....
Once you memorized the 14 patterns...thats it...your done with that scale definition.
In our case I am assuming the Major scale.

These patterns inner link forming sort of a chain link fence. All you have to do is shift them...left or right and you have changed the key!

Thats really it....

The friking hard part is the CHORDS!!!!!!!

Taking the 14 position major scale system

b3 you have Melodic Minor
b3 b6 is Harmonic Minor
b3 b6 b7 is Natural Minor

Start doing that, sequences, timing, etc.

Good luck. Many years.

Thanks for the all the great advice, looks like I have plenty to practice for a few years! Would you recommend going ahead and learning the Melodic, Harmonic and Natural Minors along with learning the major scale all at the same time, or learn the major scale and then come back and learn the others one at a time.

I would work on the major scale shapes and positions until...well...I guess that is up to you. Don't let yourself get bored. If you are slugging away on major scales and getting tired of it then move on and work on something else for a while. You can always come back. I practiced the 5 position system major scales for 5 years. That's basically 1 position a year. Playing it slow, playing it fast, playing it with a metronome, different groupings, different sequences, etc etc etc until Pebber finally said, "Would you please move on!" I tend to go overboard with focusing on one thing FAR too long. Point is, you have to focus on one thing to get good at it, but you also need to be able to move forward, come back, grow, etc. Hope this helps you.

You just had to throw a wrench into it didn't you Pebber! lol Do you mean your Diminished 8 Note Scale · Pebber Brown 14 Position System? I really enjoy watching your videos, I am glad you decided to document all your knowledge with the videos and the pdf files, I am sure it took you countless hours, the little tidbits alone that you throw in your lessons are priceless, I like the way you not only explain the lessons but you point out the reason we should practice them and how they can be used, I have never taken lessons before but I doubt too many teachers are that thorough.

Can someone double check the Multi Scale Major Scale 14 Position System - MultiScales.pdf file, the Harmonic Minor Position 4, I believe is incorrect the 13th note in the scale should be down a 1/2 step? Just want to make sure I learn it correctly. PDF File